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 Post subject: RN vs. SA/SLAA/etc
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 3:01 pm 
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Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 5:08 pm
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I hope this topic isn't a no-no. I've tried looking around on the website for the info, but can't see anything that answers my questions.

My husband is attending SLAA meetings and seeing a CSAT. He does RN stuff occasionally. I've been going to SANON and working RN.

I'm not sure if I'm imagining, but I feel like there's a big difference between RN and the twelve-steps stuff. Like.. a different vibe, or outlook, or something. Different beliefs and values maybe? I'm really not sure what I'm getting at because I can't really put my finger on it. I've also heard a few people talk about wasting time in SA then coming to RN and it working much better.

So I'm hoping maybe you guys can. :) Can someone explain the differences between RN and SA/SLAA/etc? Are there different viewpoints, beliefs, or expectations?

Thanks!


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 Post subject: Re: RN vs. SA/SLAA/etc
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 4:39 pm 
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Partner's Mentor

Joined: Mon Jul 11, 2005 9:15 pm
Posts: 477
One of the main things is that RN is a health based recovery program and SA/SLAA is disease based.

RN teaches that you have the power to take charge of your life, change your life and overcome addiction to lead a healthy life.

SA/SLAA 12 steps teach that you are powerless, your higher power has control and that you have a disease that you will never recover from. Best case scenario is that you can keep it at bay one day at a time.

It comes down to person beliefs I think. My husband attends meetings, but does not subscribe to them. I for one am glad of this as I prefer the RN way.

Starry


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 Post subject: Re: RN vs. SA/SLAA/etc
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 6:57 pm 
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This is a good question for one of the coaches to address. Coach Cheryl? Coach Mel? Coach Boundless? You know the specifics. :w:

Nellie


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 Post subject: Re: RN vs. SA/SLAA/etc
PostPosted: Mon Jun 11, 2012 9:45 pm 
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Partner's Coach (Admin)

Joined: Fri Sep 14, 2007 3:07 pm
Posts: 4646
Hi, yes, there is a different vibe. CoachBoundless saw your query and effectively wrote a (lengthy) response ( :w: ) as follows:

Quote:
Hi Raidra,

I hope you don't mind a post from the "other side," but I thought I had something to say about the differences, with my knowledge of the Recovery Workshop here. I haven't had any personal experience with SA/SAA/SLAA or other 12-Step programs in my recovery, so all I really know is what I have experienced here and read about.

As Starry said, RN follows a Health-Based Recovery approach. How this differs from a "Disease-based Recovery" approach, as we say about some other recovery methods (including some interpretations of 12 Steps), is that the focus is on values, life management skills, understanding, decision-making, and personal growth and responsibility, rather than abstinence or avoidance of compulsive behaviours.

One of the biggest differences with RN's approach is that it does not buy into the idea that addiction is a fate or a disease, or that people are powerless against it. Rather, it's a deeply ingrained, complex pattern of behaviour that has become a person's primary life management strategy. Any person in recovery who makes the transition to health will be able to see this as the absolute truth for themselves. This is also why at RN, the focus is not on the behaviours themselves, but rather the underlying patterns of thinking that drive addiction, and the roles that behaviour has come to play in the person's life. In contrast, it seems that many (not all) 12 Step groups focus primarily on controlling the behaviour merely through abstinence. Here, we'd argue that while that might be better than where a person was in their addiction, it's still not ideal in terms of quality of life, personal satisfaction, emotional maturity and understanding, etc., which are the main indicators of recovery success we'd use here.

The reason that I said earlier "interpretation of the 12 Steps" is that for any recovery program, the person's own motivation, sincerity, commitment, and how they interpret that recovery program's principles are all key factors. Jon always emphasized that there were great 12-Step groups out there that emphasized that the Steps themselves were really just a guide to the internal work you needed to do to change your life. Those groups appear to be in the minority though. It seems that the 12 Steps have been misinterpreted badly quite a lot over the years, to the point where the "once an addict, always an addict" ideas of powerlessness, abstinence-only, and the need for belief in a Higher Power in order to recover (all of which can alienate and discourage some people), have set the standard for how society views addiction and recovery.

But, the main point to take away here is: while I personally believe from my experiences here that RN is quite ahead of the curve in terms of addiction recovery and how to go about it, it should also not be taken as gospel, and it doesn't mean that other recovery methods can't also be effective or have useful principles. For example, 12 Step group settings can be very useful for people to open up, learn to communicate, and develop camaraderie with others who share their struggles (a long-term project of RN's is to develop groups like these with a focus on HBR).

RN's tools can be misinterpreted, just as the 12 Steps can be misinterpreted. As an example, RN's lessons about understanding emotions and compulsive rituals could actually be used by someone who was not sincerely interested in healthy recovery to learn how to more effectively stimulate themselves compulsively. So, intent is crucial. A recovery program's effectiveness is entirely based on the individual's motivation. RN is no more effective than reading anything else if the person doesn't put the information to practical use. What's most important is a program that someone connects with, whatever that style may be.

CoachJon actually wrote a bit about 12 Steps and HBR, and this will be included in the upcoming book "Jon's Gems" that some of the coaches are working on editing:

Quote:
What Is The Role of the 12 Steps in a Health-Based Recovery?

There is no easy answer to this. Determining the role that the 12 Steps play in one's recovery would be the equivalent of determining the role that God plays in the lives of a thousand random individuals. There is no “right” answer. Within our finite wisdom, the only answer that matters is the one that we connect to and derive value from. But unlike religion, the role of a treatment program is not to serve as your moral compass, nor is it to tell you how to live; rather, it is to teach you how to live. It should guide you in developing and using whatever values you may embrace. This is the role that the 12 Steps play within a Health-Based Recovery. If you derive meaning and value from them, then they are a part of your identity. Embrace that.

On the other hand, not everyone derives value from the 12-Step program. If you are one who does not, then choose a recovery path that does not include the 12 Steps. It's that simple. Do this with an aura of confidence, not doubt and shame. Allowing others to doubt your sincerity or potential because you don't follow the 12 Steps as they have interpreted them is as misguided as allowing others to judge you based on your religion, race, age, gender, or financial status. Such discrimination will still occur, but you have the ability to put such judgment into its proper context—specifically, that they are driven by the ignorance of others, not by your reality.

Society's Debt of Gratitude

A special thanks goes out to the founders of Alcoholics Anonymous, who provided an initial foundation for those who struggled with such a socially stigmatized issue as addiction to bond together for comfort, awareness, and acceptance. Thanks also to the pioneers of Rational Recovery, for paving the way for those not comfortable with the 12-Step philosophy to feel accepted. Were these perfect approaches? No, nothing is—including the workshops at Recovery Nation. It is all a learning process, as outlined below in some of my thoughts regarding the authors of AA's Blue Book:

While the architects of AA should forever be in everyone's gratitude for such a revolutionary approach, and a pure desire to make themselves and their society better, do keep in mind that what they wrote back in the 1930s was cutting edge—back in the 1930s. With all sociological theories, an evolution must take place, and this is especially true in addiction recovery. So much has been learned about the human condition over the past 70 years that it is unfair to compare today's approaches to then. This is not to say that some of their earlier hypotheses were wrong—well, yes, some were absolutely wrong, but many continue to form the basis for today's recovery community—only that the authors were at a significant disadvantage due to not having the benefit of knowing "what we know now.” They were making things up as they went, based on their own intuition and experience. Well, that and a recovery model loosely based on another created in the late 1800s. But they did well. Not perfect, but definitely good.

You've heard the mantra, "Once an addict, always an addict.” Well, while such a statement is not technically a "lie,” as a lie implies deception, such statements are not accurate either. Not with what we know today to be true of addiction. They may be accurate on the surface, offering a sense of temporary stability and identity, but they are offering the wrong identity for permanent change to occur.

We know this now—we didn't back then. So, absolutely read such books and apply what you feel makes sense to you. But don't make the "elders" of AA into something that they are not. They were people, just like you and I. They were fallible, just like you and I. We, however, have a significant advantage in terms of all that has been learned about human nature and addiction over the past 70 years. We have the luxury of taking the best of their work and helping it to evolve into today's society. That gives us a significant advantage in taking addiction recovery further than they ever thought possible.

People have asked me if I think I know more than some of the pioneers in addiction recovery. I can only respond by praying with all of my heart that, with 70 years of observing people’s additional experience to add to their initial foundation of insights, I do know better—as should we all. And my guess is, if we were to go back in time, that would be exactly what the founding fathers of AA would have wanted—for us to take their original concepts and guide the evolution towards a destination that they could never have envisioned at that time.

If it helps, think of addiction recovery as a race across an endless plane. Not a race where we all start from the beginning and follow the exact same path. If that were the case, we would all end in relatively the same spot, determined only by our life expectancy. Seventy years ago, that ending was thought to be a diseased life where addiction could not be overcome, merely managed on a day-to-day basis. No, this is a team race, where each racer continues to chart a more direct path for the next, removing more and more obstacles for those who follow. Such an approach allows all of us to go further than ever imagined previously.

But removing such obstacles becomes a necessity, which is the purpose of Recovery Nation—to help remove more obstacles from your path. Otherwise, people will continue stumbling over the same obstacles that those before them stumbled over. And they will die thinking that they were an addict. They will die thinking that they were born an addict. They will die thinking that they were somehow defective. They will die thinking that they had a “disease” that controlled their life. And such thoughts are all obstacles to making a healthy transition in life.

Over the past 70 years, it has been proven that addiction can be overcome—proven by many. The need now is to get that message out to those committed to leaving addiction behind.

One point of caution before deciding to abandon the 12 Steps...

Before giving up on the potential of using the 12 Steps to help guide you, remember that not all 12-Step programs are the same. The individual communities and "leaders" of local groups often provide a completely different environment than the one(s) you have previously attended or heard about. One of the great weaknesses of 12-Step programs is that the messages are passed from addict to addict, with many of the messengers never having learned to effectively implement those insights themselves, or even understanding those insights as intended. So, the message gets continuously distorted in the wrong hands. Don't let the health, incompetence, or misapplication of what are otherwise solid recovery strategies deter you from seeking the truth. If you find yourself dismissing the 12-Step program based solely on what you believe the program entails, keep in mind that most often, your beliefs are inaccurate. What you will discover is that it has been the message that has been skewed, not its benefits when applied efficiently. As an example, let's quickly look at the first step:

Step One: We admit we are powerless over our compulsive behaviour and that our lives have become unmanageable.

A potentially unhealthy interpretation:

One of the earliest and most devastating misperceptions of implementing the 12 Steps into a healthy recovery is found right here. More than any other misperception, save for the role of a Higher Power in recovery, the misguided belief that by admitting we are powerless, we are: subtly absolved of our responsibilities; somehow damaged, incapable of developing the skills that come naturally for others; admitting that because we are powerless, we remain powerless forever or that we have no power to enact real change, all have the potential to do catastrophic damage to one’s perception of their recovery possibilities and life potential. Such falsehoods often have the following impact on those seeking recovery:

1) They offer the lack of responsibility that produces “an excuse” or “an explanation” for their behavior. While this may provide temporary comfort, it destroys the personal responsibility needed to actively develop the life management skills that are necessary to end the addictive patterns.

2) It turns off those who would have otherwise benefitted from implementing such steps into their recovery. While some are comforted by their unhealthy perceptions of being “powerless,” others are infuriated by it. They have worked too hard, and have accomplished too much in their lives to consider themselves powerless. To them, such an admission is the ultimate blow. The ultimate failure. And because they refuse to accept it, they quit their involvement with the 12 Step program. But again, this perception is also misguided, as such powerlessness is not intended to be an all-or-nothing phenomenon.

A potentially healthy interpretation

For most, you have spent years trying to stop/control your behavior. You have likely tried many things: promises to God, your family, yourself. You may have spent time in a treatment center. You may have read fifteen books on recovery, applying what you have learned each time. And each time, your efforts have ended in failure. Or, what you perceive to be failure.
But the truth to the first step is that you’re admitting that you alone are powerless to end your destructive patterns. You have tried unsuccessfully and you are now ready to admit openly that this is something that you cannot control by yourself. Such a perception is not an admission of failure, but a statement of fact. With your current skills, your current values, and your current experiences, you do not possess the power to end this addiction. There is nothing even remotely wrong with accepting such a fact.

This does not mean that you are weak, and this does not mean that you are powerless in all things. What is especially true is that it does not mean that you have no power in your recovery. It only means that you currently lack the power to take yourself all the way through the transition from addiction to health.

Conclusion

The 12-Step program can offer you much in terms of a healthy recovery. Ultimately though, it will be your interpretation and application of what you learn there that will determine its effectiveness. Participation in such a 12-Step community is not necessary for a permanent recovery and in some cases, can even be detrimental, depending on the health of the specific community in question.

On the other hand, your involvement with a healthy 12-step community can be a stabilizing factor in allowing you to achieve acceptance and understanding of your addiction. Beyond your personal motivation and commitment, there are few better indicators for success than your ability to get involved with a healthy, live (as in, face-to-face and ongoing) support system. In a Health-Based Recovery, your participation in the 12 Steps is considered on the same plane as any other value that you may hold. It is your value. Our focus will be on your ability to derive the greatest value from it.

---------

I received a question from someone via email about the 12 Steps and wanted to share my response. Not because it is the “right” response and I certainly don't want to turn this into a “12-Step bashing.” Instead, I would love insights from others who have used the 12-step model successfully—those who have used the program to make fundamental changes to the core of who they are. At some point, I would like to develop a detailed evolution of the 12 Steps to use in helping such groups get past the recovery/relapse cycle that seems to dominate many such groups. Until that happens, it is something that should be openly explored in a positive way.

Here is what I shared:

As for your question about my thoughts on the 12 Steps, I will be blunt. There are a handful of excellent 12-Step programs that are sponsored by healthy people who “get it.” Who understand that the 12 Steps are a metaphorical guide for the internal work that needs to take place in one's life. Unfortunately, the great many people driving such groups do not get this. Thus, they promote the very misperceptions that perpetuate a society of addiction and a life-long recovery/relapse cycle for the individual.

The great value they hold is in the social understanding and acceptance for issues that, prior to the 12 Steps, had no such outlet. As well, it can provide people with structure in approaching their recovery from addiction. But these steps were created over 70 years ago, in a different time in our society. Tell me what has not evolved in the past 70 years? Tell me what has never had the need to be improved? The 12 Steps are no different, though many who protect them do so with the same conviction as an individual protecting their religion. But the 12 Steps is not a religion; it is merely a guide to working through addiction. That's it. It is not magical. It is not spiritual. It doesn't need protection. It doesn't need to be validated. It doesn't need to use fear or shame to develop its community. It should simply exist for those who find value in it. And yet, while certainly not intentional, it has nevertheless evolved into a program that uses all of these things at times. Not universally—again, there are excellent, healthy 12 Step groups out there. But such things are reported consistently. Add to this the dismal recovery rate (something that I don’t put much value in, by the way) and you would be a fool to continue blindly following something that doesn't feel right to you and something that you are not connecting with. The same goes for Recovery Nation. If you don't connect to what is being shared and the style, keep searching for something that you do connect with. Just make sure that you give these programs enough time to really understand what it is they are trying to do, rather than taking a “first impression” and projecting everything else.

And so, if you stay in the 12 Steps, make sure that you understand what it is you’re doing there. Make sure that everything you do is in congruence with your values and that you do not ever feel pressured to adopt other values to match “the group.” That doesn't mean you shouldn't listen to those in the group—especially those who have taken those steps and produced core changes to their identity. These are very valuable people to learn from. But again, this particular group would be the minority. So keep your eyes wide open and your values protected as you move forward.

These are my thoughts based not only on my own experiences with the 12 Steps, but from the testimonials of thousands. I hope it helps you gain confidence in embracing whatever gut feelings you may be having about them.

“I am an addict and my life has become unmanageable.”

A member posted this Alcoholics Anonymous moniker in a thread and I just wanted to update it a bit to reflect a more healthy, clear approach to recovery. Rather than "I am an addict and my life has become unmanageable"—which may very well be accurate—change that perception to “I have learned to manage my life through addiction."

Perceiving it this way allows you to see much more clearly the role that addiction plays in your life and the areas most in need of development. Also, it begins to erode the false notion that addiction is somehow a natural part of your identity. Addiction is a behavioral pattern that has developed to play a very important role in your life. It is not, however, who you are. At its depth, these patterns can ingrain into your identity to seem as though they are natural, especially when dealing with behaviors relating to natural emotions such as love, passion, and desire. But the patterns themselves—they have been developed. They are not natural. And they can be changed.

So when you can recognize within yourself that "I no longer manage my life through addiction," you will no longer be addicted. Your identity will have changed. The way that you manage your life will have changed. You will no longer have to see yourself as an “addict” but rather, as a healthy person who previously used addiction to manage their life. All of the tools and experiences that you have developed along the way will be used to help monitor and maintain that life. And only your conscious efforts (or inability to continue managing your life with existing tools—for instance, in the face of major trauma or complacency) will allow a return of such addiction patterns.



I hope this answers your questions.

CoachBoundless

_________________
First say to yourself what you would be; and then do what you have to do. (Epictetus)


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 Post subject: Re: RN vs. SA/SLAA/etc
PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2012 7:47 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 09, 2012 5:08 pm
Posts: 58
Thank you so much! That definitely answered my question, and was very informative and insightful. Thank you for putting words to the nebulous feelings I was having about the 12 Steps. The only way I could explain it to my husband when we talked about it yesterday was that when I work on RN, I feel that there might be hope, whereas when I go to SANON or listen to what my husband relates from his meetings, I mostly feel discouraged and hopeless. It was also interesting to read about the history of AA and how that plays into things.

Thank you!


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